Production

[DanCooper]

Paravil, In science, nothing can ever be proved absolutely. There are experiments going on now to test a "reactionless drive". I doubt that it will work, but if it does, it will overthrow the theory of gravity. Climate has always changed, but all the evidence now points to a human-caused acceleration in the rate of change that nature will have a very hard time adapting to.

Saying "Let's not do anything about this risk until it is totally proved" is like saying "I won't buy insurance until it is totally proved that I will get sick or have an accident" or "I won't invest my money anywhere until it is totally proved that I will make a profit."

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I hadn't heard of the Swiss Tremola. I can't find any evidence that it is in production. According to their website, updated February 2015 (22 months ago) "le Tremola sera lancé au printemps prochain sur le marché helvète à un prix situé entre 17.000 et 18.000 € HT." This says it will be introduced in Switzerland in Spring 2016. I can't find anything more recent about it. They say it is homologized in the category L5e. That just means it is a "véhicule à trois roues symétriques, équipé d’un moteur d’une cylindrée supérieure à 50 cm ³ s’il est à combustion interne et / ou dont la vitesse maximale par construction est supérieure à 45 km / h". That is to say it isn't a sidecar motorcycle and it can't be considered to be a bicycle. The SRK would meet that requirement also.

Also, I am curious, what happens to a tilting vehicle like this or like the Piaggio MP3 if you skid on ice?

[paravil]

Dan, I´ve talked to them about their web site (there is an Engl. language version!). Tremola is a mountain pass in the Swiss Alps (where the factory is). It´s a project financed by a small engineering and machine tool company and development work is progressing slowly. The prototype development is over and the bodywork is now ready for production. If you enter Tremola on uTube, you´ll get the latest reults. All it now needs is the doors. The vehicle is an electric three wheeler with the drive wheels at the back. It is narrow (under 80cm) and leans into a turn (so is oiptimal for urban usage: can park anywhere and filter through congested traffic). Statiionary (or at less then 5km/h), the leaning mechanism is blocked. On ice, it would skid (like any other vehicle), depending on speed and turn direction. The speed is over 100 kph (ample for me), and endurance is also quite good for urban use.

Apparently, it could not be registered in the US, as narrow vehicles are banned by US laws stipulating the angle at which they could be parked sideways on a slope without tipping over.

PS

Dan, your example for climatre change actvity is flawed. Insurance mathematics provides ample proof and quite exact results to show precise risk evaluation. Whereas I have to take the human influence on climate change at face value on the sole basis of statements that are contested by an equally reputable section of the scientific elite.

[Rickb]

Paravil,  The Tremola tips over if driven and or parked on a certain slope or incline % and as a result can't meet compliance testing in the US?   Doesn't sound like a good quality in a narrow vehicle being driven anywhere in the world.

The science based community that doesn't support the scientific fact that global warming is real and 'most likely' caused by humans are those scientists that are petroleum or geology based.  Why gamble the environment away for future generations if there are responsible things we can do within reason to change it helping to insure it doesn't turn crappier than it already is?  Is there some personal cost to you that impacts your present lifestyle or is it opinion based only?  Don't want to debate the issue, or really care, but I am curious why people would risk it.     

I believe in science, but not a hardcore environmentalist, and may be too old to care, but feel it doesn't cost me personally to support some reasonable effort, just in case.   Heck, it could improve our economy , develop new tech, create jobs, and force auto manufacturers to provide us with the vehicle of our dreams.

[DanCooper]

I couldn't find any evidence online that the Tremola trike is for sale now. The most recent Youtube video I could find is 2014. The Piaggio MP3 is apparently no longer for sale in the USA, but I couldn't find any reference to regulatory problems for it. The Piaggio and the Tremola have a similar tilt system, but Piaggio has sold a lot of them in Europe. Below 5 mph it locks at whatever tilt it is at, so you can stop without putting your feet down, even on a side slope.

On ice, a car or a trike like the SRK will slide but not tip. A 2-wheel motorcycle will fall over as soon as it skids, unless you have your feet down in advance, and even then it is dicey. Been there, done that. A tilting trike, as soon as it is free to tilt (over 5 mph), I suspect it would behave like a motorcycle, unless there is something I don't know.

[DanCooper]

Paravil, about climate theory. I have studied a lot of science. I take nothing on authority. I check it for myself. The evidence I have found for human-caused climate change is overwhelming. This includes my personal observations of glaciers, wildfires, and wildlife migrations. The arguments you give, I see them on a narrow range of websites that all quote each other. I have looked into the data they use. When I find the complete data set that they have extracted part of, it tells a very different story from the one they are putting forth.

The mainstream press tries to be unbiased by presenting both sides of an issue. There is a problem with this, because if 99 scientists believe one thing and 1 believes another, they give them equal time, and it gives the false impression that their arguments are equally valid.

Suppose you went to a doctor, who said you have cancer and it should be treated. Then you go to 100 doctors for their opinions. 97 of them say you have cancer and it should be treated. 3 say you don't have cancer and don't worry about it. 2 of those are not MDs. What are you going to do?

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There is no such thing as a scientific elite. Scientific method is a way anyone, scientist or not, can check whether something is good science or bad science. It is true, some bad science is done to support the interests of those paying for it. The fossil fuel companies are paying for bad science about climate change. Who is paying the mainstream scientists for opposing results? What mainstream climate scientists are getting rich?

[paravil]

Rick, parked sideways on a steep slope is not a safety issue anywhere I am likely to drive (and I wouldn´t park my bike sideways on a slope either).

The Tremola is not on the market yet (and nor are the SRK or the Solo). With doors, I´ll be looking at the Tremola and the SRK.

Re: climate change, I am not inclined to delve into speculation as to who manipulates the relevant science (just as I don´t care a monkey´s who shot the president). Conspiracy theories are for nuts.

[DanCooper]

Paravil, if you are not inclined to delve into speculation as to who manipulates the relevant science, how can you believe that most scientists are wrong? Isn't that a conspiracy theory?

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Anyway, the SRK is a good example of the things that could be done that would fight climate change, and even if climate change turns out to be false, it would still be a very good thing to do. My biggest worry is that so many other neat vehicles have been hyped and then have disappeared before production. I really hope Arcimoto makes it.

[Rickb]

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A recent Arcimoto Facebook reply indicates the A Team will be sending out an end of the year Newsletter updating progress on the Signature Series builds, testing, status of the anticipated 2017 production schedule, and I hope mention of the enclosure panel option.

[paravil]

Have just heard from the Swiss developers of the Tremolo:-
- a new version of their web site is planned to appear before Christmas, together with a new u-Tube video of the latest development,
- the Swiss/German TÜV (technical vehicle authority) acceptance certificate has recently been issued,
- setbacks with their previous battery concept and recent Euro problems have now been overcome and first deliveries of the final production version are expected early next year, although a limited number of hand assembled units will be delivered to specific customers shortly.

Re: Narrow, leaning vehiucles safety on ice:-

Ram, please take a look at Phillip James´ Australian website (http://tiltingvehicle.blogspot.de/ ) to see how these vehicles react when driven on the official Australian vehicle testing skid pan. A motorbike is notoriously difficult on ice, and will probably do a highsider at some point. A three-or four-wheeled tilting vehicle will NOT tip over!

It would likely be hilarious to see either the Arcimoto, or especially the Solo attempt a quick, high speed turn on any surface ... (photos of the latest `racing´ version of the Solo show the amount of scaffolding that was welded on to provide a very necessary birdcage for the driver)

[Rickb]

Thanks for the update info on the Tremola!  I liked the Tremola the first time I saw it and hope it finally gets to market, particularly the enclosed version.  

The birdcage around the Solo Racer is to protect the driver at high speeds.  I'm guessing the racer top speed to be well over 100 mph.  They are Formula 1 Race Car Drivers and safety is first and foremost to these guys not an afterthought.  

Three wheelers can and will tip over on any surface so I would appreciate as many safety features as possible........in the Tremola, Solo, or SRK.  The CarverOne owner's reported many such incidents.  The Solo and SRK Tadpole platform may prove to be more stabile than the Tremolo's.